The hearing is scheduled to begin around 1:30 p.m. The judge is back on the bench. The witness is Toby Ford another probation officer. She supervises probation officer Burton in Birmingham.
"I met with him (Scrushy) on March 29...He explained he traveled via a personal jet from Orlando to Miami..."
Do you know of any reason why Mr. Scrushy would have told you he took a plane when he in fact went down there on a yacht? No sir.
Do you know whether he flew down there or went down there on a boat? No sir.
"It's important that...he is traveling where he says he is going to be traveling to..."
What day of the week was the 29th," asks Mr. Parkman. "It's on a Thursday....It was an appointment....It was my understanding Mr. Burton requested the meeting...It was just an understanding he had an appointment that day."
"Here is what I want to show you...here's what I'm trying to get at....you just assumed by your conversations that it was Mr. Burton who asked Mr. Scrushy to come in..."
"My objection is your honor he's arguing with the witness," says Mr. Feaga.
The judge tells Parkman to "move on. You've made your point."
"We met in the office," says the witness. You sure? Not the conference room? No sir says the witness.
Ms. Ford says it's not that far between West Palm Beach and Miami. He had requested to go on one day travel to Ocala...to look at some property in the West Palm Beach area and return back to Orlando..."
"I'm not aware that he informed Montgomery...there was some variance from the initial travel request...as far as Mr. Burton he says he did give him permission to travel to Orlando, Ocala, and West Palm Beach..."
"And didn't give the information to anyone else," "That's my understanding," says Ford.
Ford says "He apologized for the miscommunication...He did go into detail as to what he expressed some concern as to what was communicated and he understood that Mr. Burton may have misunderstood him...I was just there to hear the conversation....there was going to be some confrontation...inquire specifically...."
Parkman wants to know about the flight again. "It was toward the end of the conversation when I asked him how he got to get to Miami...he said Donald Watkins took him on his private jet...the entire conversation 35-40 minutes...It was after the first 10-15 minutes we started talking about the specifics of his itinerary...the first 10-15 minutes we just let Mr. Scrushy talk...He said he got a call from Donald Watkins saying he needed to talk to him about some new developments in his case...Well the conversation lasted 40 minutes...He got back on Donald Watkins' plane."
With regard to where he said is there anything today incorrect,"asks Parkman. "He was asked if he moved anywhere on the yacht?" He said no." Parkman asks if she asked which slip, she says no she did not.
Ford says Scrushy has made 10-12 trips prior to this. She says this is the first occasion problems have arisen. She's not familiar with all the specifics. She says she also knows of no violation in the Birmingham case.
Mr. Feaga wants to know about Scrushy's prior trips and deviation. "I've only been a supervising probation officer since January this year." She says Scrushy operated outside the parameters authorized by the court. She agrees someone found out about it and reported it. She now says "I have no idea whether it's happened in the past, this is just the first occasion we've had to deal with it."
Mr. Parkman wants to know when she found out what Mr. Burton had said Mr. Scrushy could do? She says the 27th of March.
Your opinion he violated the term is based on what? "Mr Scrushy said he did deviate from his plans."
Did he say,"I'm sorry there was a misunderstanding, I thought I had permission," says Parkman.
Ford says, "Scrushy did not have permission to go to Miami...He admitted he did not have specific permission to go to Miami..."
Ford says as far as she knows Scrushy didn't go to Ocala. She says she nor Burton asked why. Ford says Scrushy "yes, he did indicate he had gone to West Palm Beach...He met with Donald Watkins...in Miami."
Ford is taken back to the question about West Palm Beach..."He told us he was checking on some property that he has..."
Ford says she nor Mr. Burton asked specifically the property was. "He said he left on Tuesday and came back to Birmingham on Saturday...but specifically which day I don't know..."
"What he's doing is ...in essence arguing with the witness...the issue here is what was done...and whether or not he was truthful with these officers." says Mr. Feaga.
"It's important because it goes to how Mr. Scrushy says he got permission to go to south Florida...according to him he told them he was going to West Palm Beach," says Parkman.
Mr. Leach's e-mail is objected to by Mr. Parkman #1 under this type violation of sixth amendment right to confront.
Why is the communication before two lawyers a sixth amendment violation?
Even though it's between two lawyers it doesn't get to the exception of the sixth amendment...it took place without us getting into.
It's a given he did not (represent the captain)
Mr. Scrushy by engaging with Capt. Kirtz...has to do with the fact that one of the things he told Mr. Kirtz to represent Mr.
I don't understand what an e-mail has to do with
One of the issues is...whether or not he can be expected to comply with the orders of the court....
Hand me the e-mail,"says Judge Coody. "This is one of those odd opportunities a judge gets to consider what he will and won't consider after considering it." The objection is sustained by the judge.
"I find it to be irrelevant...it goes to the question whether Mr. Leach represents Mr. Kirtz and that's an irrelevant fact..."
Mr. Scrushy has frustrated the efforts of his probation officer and others while he's out on release.
Mr. Scrushy is being called to the stand.
Scrushy takes the stand. Any doubt you were placed on restriction - "to the Middle and Northern District," says Scrushy.
Scrushy says, "I have made a lot of trips 25-30...just the Montgomery case? 10-12...New York, Miami, Orlando, Dallas, Houston, even to the west coast, one trip to the Bahamas, South Carolina...spring break (for the Bahamas)...I went down to a meeting with Donald Watkins the earlier part of this year I don't remember the date....It was sometimes in the last couple of weeks of February...told Barry Burton we were planning a spring vacation...I told him I had plans to visit my father in law in Ocala and that I would also be going to south Florida to visit friends and family to include Palm Beach...to me south Florida means all the way to Key West...."
Scrushy says he was not asked to fill out an itinerary but that Burton told him the trip was approved....he says he was not limited to the Orlando area..."as a matter of fact he knew I was going because I was going...I told him I would be visiting friends and family...I will be visiting around south Florida."
Scrushy says this to him included "all of south Florida...we flew out of Birmingham to Orlando...stayed at the Saratoga springs resort...paid for it on my credit card...."
"I told Ms. Martin exactly what I did. I told her day by day what I did...never left the canal..never went out (into open water)..." Scrushy says he was called by Ms. Martin "I was on a cell phone and couldn't hear real good...I didn't catch the name...they asked me had I gotten home...I said no, I was approved to stay until Saturday..."
Scrushy agrees he had "arrangements to fly into Orlando on Southwest flights and out of Orlando on Southwest flights...."
Scrushy says he was not able to get the flight changed from Saturday to Friday. "I received a call from Ms. Martin...she said are you home..I said I have approval to come home on Saturday...that was my communication and my understanding...I'll be flying home...she did ask me if we had a good time..."
Scrushy says, "No she didn't (ask him where he was." She did say Mr. Burton was out of town and she was making the call for him...I told him
Conference call with "Mr. Watkins, you and another one of my attorneys..." Scrushy says she talked to him afterwords and to report in.
Scrushy says "for children it was a very bad place to be. the whole Miami Beach area is not a good area...so we moved it to a nicer area....moved it to Bayside...a place where they could enjoy themselves...."
Scrushy says the entire time he was on the boat he got off the ship,"When we got to Palm Beach it was about dark we did take the family out to a restaurant...we didn't take the boat again until we got back to Miami...I went to see a doctor I hurt my neck...I went to a chiropractor and had my neck worked on...before we left on that Wednesday we went to a couple of places...."
"I flew out of....Donald Watkins agreed if I came to meet with him he would fly me and my family home...number one she couldn't fit on the plane (the nanny) She had a flight out of Palm Beach."
Scrushy says he got back to Birmingham after lunch. He says he heard from the probation office the next Tuesday..."I need to see you this afternoon or tomorrow morning...I asked if I could do it this afternoon..." He says he showed up at 4:00. "She says when did she leave, how did you leave...I told her we drove to Palm Beach told her everything all the way from getting on the plane to coming home...I told Burton everywhere I was going...I did exactly as I told him I would do...and as he told me I could do...the reason we didn't go to Ocala...her stepmother was very sick and had surgery and they were unable to accommodate us...so we didn't go...I told her exactly how I got back...Day by day every place we went..."
Scrushy says the meeting lasted about an hour. "I told her it was very important I talked to Mr. Burton...and I thought it was important...she acted like she wanted to take some kind of action...she said you have to understand we can only go by what we have in writing...I told her he did give me that permission, discussed it with me...I called Mr. Burton as soon as I left her office...I explained to him I had met with Ms. Martin and ...we need to have a meeting...He said...I can meet with you first thing on Thursday...I was there at 9 a.m....He was there and his supervisor...in his office...First thing I said to him is Mr. Burton you need to tell the truth this is wrong..."
Scrushy says he was not aware of other conversations. He says he never saw the e-mail and he was never asked to look over it..."I told you I would be visiting family and friends in south Florida...he said I know, but I didn't think you would go to Miami....He acknowledged it..."
Scrushy says regarding flying to Miami, "They never asked me to go step by step...she didn't tell me...Ms. Martin was very throughout and went through every day...I did say I flew back...I never told them I flew there...it doesn't make sense..it's only 40 miles I think....I don't know where they got that..it doesn't make any sense..."
Scrushy says, "I told her I drove a rental van to Palm Beach...I told her I spent the night on the boat...we went to Ft. Lauderdale...because of all those draw bridges ti takes forever...the boat was there it gave us an accommodation....that's where we stayed..."
She asked me how I left, when I got home, did I spend the night on the boat. I asked to have the meeting and I did most of the talking...I had been accused of something that was not true...I did have approval...I would never have gone to a place I didn't have approval..."
Scrushy said they went through every place in his residence. "I don't recall the exact date...he had been on another assignment working for someone else...I had talked to a broker about selling the boat..I was told there was some damage that needed to be repaired and I told him I needed to get the boat fixed...people aren't going to buy a boat that's not ready...he told me the first mate had left...we had to deal with that...the other thing was that we were going to Disney World and we may want to come visit with them and spend the night on the boat....it was the week right before we went up...I don't remember exactly...probably 5-7 days...I didn't give him an exact date because I didn't have an exact date..."
Scrushy says he stayed at Disney World while he was at Disney World. "I believed based on the conversation I had with the probation officer I had permission to visit family and friends in south Florida.."
Scrushy is asked about the Leach situation,"When he called me, Captain and told me that an FBI agent had called him and wanted to meet with him...we talked to him...we had a lawyer to meet with him..my personal observation...was he didn't want to meet with them...I told them to call Mr. Leach..."
Scrushy says Leach is in Disney World today.
Scrushy says the captain "had a fear of meeting them without an attorney...I told the Captain to tell the absolute truth...whatever he needed to do to totally cooperate with them..."
Parkman asks if Scrushy discussed imaginary plans to leave the country, "Never," says Scrushy.
The captain told me since the boat has not been out of the country that every time it's moved you have to report it to customs...when we decided to make the trip..I told him we needed to get the proper approval...he said he had to call them (customs)..."
"We had planned a vacation to the Bahamas...the trial was extensive...and the trial didn't turn out the way I thought it should so we had to bring the boat back...I think the discussion was I just hadn't seen the boat back in a long time and I just needed to check on it...I had not seen the boat in a long time...I just needed to check on it...because it takes a long time to get over there...it's easier to fly..."
Scrushy says he was never on his boat the summer of 2006.
Mr. Parkman says he has one more thing. "Do you recall any conversation with Mrs. Ford about the boat staying in a slip the entire time? No...it never went out into the sea."
Mr. Feaga will get his chance now at Mr. Scrushy.
Sir, how long have you been under the supervision of Ms. Martin? Since the fall of 05. Burton? Same amount of time.
In all that time have they been straight forward with you? I haven't really talked to Ms. Martin except when I came to get my passport.
You talked to her on the 23rd of March? Yes.
It's your position she's misrepresenting and mischaracterizing the conversation with you? I did not leave her with that impression...I'm saying she didn't ask me where I was and what was I doing.
You're going to do whatever you want to do and say the court didn't ask me the right thing? No sir I wouldn't do that.
Did you tell her you were in Miami? No sir.
"I asked them if I could go to Orlando to visit Disney World...and south Florida..."
"I asked for permission to travel to south Florida and it was granted."
"And you knew at the time you were planning on leaving on the 20th and traveling to Palm Beach and to Miami..."
"I did tell them I would be traveling to south Florida...I was not required to report..."
Mr. Parkman says there is a mischaracterization of the evidence. Judge Coody says I'll let the question stand and sustain the objection to the form.
"She didn't ask me any questions, one question - are you home....if she had asked me the question I would have told her the truth...she asked me quickly...check with Mr. Burton...she said I'll do that...I didn't evade anything...she set up..."
"Do you understand you don't get to decide what the right question is?"
"I can't answer what she doesn't ask me," says Scrushy. "Sir I was given permission to travel in south Florida."
Are you telling this court Mr. Burton mischaracterized the state of the evidence. "I told Mr. Burton I would be traveling in south Florida...Miami never came up..."
Did you tell Ms. Martin the boat had not been out in two years..."That's not what I said...that's totally taken out of context...in an hour long conversation...what I was trying to point out to her was I hadn't seen my boat in a while...she asked me when I got on it and I told her the truth..."
"Two separate conversations...you're tying something together that didn't happen."
How should i ask the question? Anyway you want," responds Scrushy.
"Did you or did you not tell Ms. Martin the boat had been out in two years?" "That's not what I told her."
"I told Ms. Martin day-by-day hour by hour what I had done..so I think they were confused..."
"I heard what they said...but that's not what I said...they did not ask me play by play...they asked me if i spent the night on the boat..."
"Oh what a complicated web we weave when we practice to deceive? " Yes sir.
"Is it possible you've forgotten what the truth is," "No sir I don't think so."
You heard Baker testified you had told the boat captain that he was represented by Art Leach and the boat captain feeling loyal to you.
"I heard him say that."
He didn't cooperate with law enforcement. Did you tell him not to cooperate....Did you tell him not to talk to the FBI..
"I told him we had a lawyer and to call the lawyer."
Do you know why people need to know where you are...why did you tell him not to cooperate ?
That's not what I said.
Scrushy says it took the captain a while to call him back.
How long did it take the captain to call you back when the FBI came?
Did you tell him to cooperate....? No sir that's not what I said.
Feaga is asking about Donald Watkins. "That's why you went down there?" He called me on a Tuesday morning...we tried to set the meeting up on Thursday...Donald couldn't do it on Thursday so we did it on Friday...I went to Miami to meet with my attorney (in answer to a question for a judge)
When you only made reservations for four days how did you know Watkins would call you and ask to see you...?
You heard probation officer Burton...tell you you could go to Ocala. "That's not south? says Feaga.
"Why did you lie to him about why you wanted to go to Palm Beach?" I told him I wanted to go check on some property...
Did you hear him say he would not have given you permission to get on a boat?
You know that you wouldn't have gotten permission...isn't that why you didn't ask? That's not true says Scrushy.
Feaga "Mr. Scrushy when did the captain of your yacht first call you and advise you the FBI was at the Sail Fish Club?" I really don't remember...it was after I met with Ms. Martin...I don't know the exact date.
Did you talk to your attorneys after you talked to Ms. Martin but before you met with Mr. Burton up in Birmingham..."Mr. Parkman was out of town...I don't believe i had a meeting with them..I may have talked to Art Leach but I don't remember..."
Mr. Feaga again asks the question showing Scrushy the letter. "Mr. Parkman was out of town...but I may have talked to Mr. Leach...I can't tell you...I may have had a phone call...I'm not 100% sure...I probably talked to them after I met with him..."
Did you consult with your lawyers "I told Art i felt I needed to clarify the conversation I had with Mr. Burton..."
Was he telling the truth? Some of the events are in this letter exactly as he said. I think Palm Beach is obviously in south Florida.
How was the weather? Horrible. How was the weather in the Gulf? Probably horrible to.
Point being if you wanted to go out into open water on that trip you couldn't have gone? It was an ugly week says Scrushy.
Feaga is asking about customs. Do you know whether or not your captain was notifying customs he was going to have a convicted felon on the boat, he gave them my Social Security number..we gave them all the notification required...
"Is that all you need to do ...is that sufficient notice?" Do you consider that effective notice to the U.S. Probation Office..."I'm struggling with what you're asking me," says Scrushy. I told him He knew about it...Miami is in south Florida.....
"Do you consider that effective notice?" "I don't think reporting to customs has anything to do with this, if that's what you're asking me..."
Mr. Parkman is back up..."In talking there's no doubt that Mr. Burton was very much aware you were going to go to Disney World, Ocala, and West Palm Beach? Yes sir
Your version was you were going to south Florida..."To go meet with Donald Watkins...to discuss some very important issues in our case..that were new...I wanted to do it on Thursday...but he had to do it on Friday...we met at 9:00
The judge wants to know why Scrushy would take a boat to go 70 miles when you had a rental car? Bridge after bridge? why didn't you just drive down...Why didn't you put your family in the van"Because he was going to fly us to Birmingham..."
"I didn't know how long he was going to keep us down there...I didn't see any harm in us staying on the boat..."
What other friends and family were you going to meet? check on my property, check on my boat, meet with Captain....who are my friends
Why weren't you more explicit with your probation officer? I didn't have an agenda....I didn't get to go to Ocala...it was cold it was raining I had to go deal with my legal issues.
Parkman "Where does Donald Watkins live?" South Beach. Why didn't you get in the van and get a hotel room..."To get three rooms is almost impossible, it was spring break..."
"Her flight was out of Palm Beach and then we didn't have room on the plane so we had to get her carted back up...we did not plan to fly out of Miami..."
When you first made the reservations to go who was the only person you talked to ? Barry Burton.
Never talked to Ms. Martin? Never.
Did he say he would handle it all? Yes, sir that's what he said.
Even Ms. Martin didn't get the Ocala and West Palm Beach inquiry? That's correct.
Mr. Feaga is coming back for a couple more questions.
Sir if finding room for your family down at Miami Beach was going to be a problem why not drive down there by yourself? Do you want me to say I wanted to be on my boat, I did.
Feaga asks if Scrushy wants to change any of his testimony. Parkman objects to the question word falsely.
You've said at least 7 or 8 times that they testified falsely incorrectly...do you want to change your testimony? "There were many things that were mischaracterized...obviously they couldn't tell it all the same...I've told the truth...I tell you everything should have been in writing...I'll be exactly where I was supposed to be..."
I remember you being told to be in compliance with the terms of your release? Now your saying it has to be in writing?
"That's a twisted statement...I'm only saying because there's miscommunication we need to have it in writing...we wouldn't be here today...this is a miscommunication....they're good people and I'm a good man...I'm sorry this has happened but I did exactly what I told that gentleman I was going to do...Mr. Burton said himself he didn't put it in writing..."
Judge Coody wants to know what the purpose is? "This man can't be supervised..." "We'll discuss that in oral argument." Feaga, "I've made my point."
We will take a recess until 3:30 p.m.
New post for closing statements. will try to clean this stuff up for everyone tonight.
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